Battle of the Sexes

[Charlotte Smith]

Pretty self-explanatory: who do you think has it worse off( girls vs. guys) and why.

[Vertigo_One [Ops Mod]]

In the United States, right now, women have preferential treatment – by law – in any company that gets federal funds (which heaven help us, right now, is most of them.)  Women live longer than men.  Cancers that affect females get more money and more attention than those that affect only men.  Women have the right to be sole deciders on abortion, and if they decide to keep the child and make the man pay, he pays.  (This by the way is a complete reversal of the “penalty” of sex which used to fall mostly on women.)  And if he doesn’t pay, he goes to jail.  Divorce courts award custody to mothers overwhelmingly.  Oh, and in college campuses, women outnumber men.

http://accordingtohoyt.com/2012/03/18/war-is-hell/

[Jackalope Joe D'Antonio]

I am gonna have to say dudes because I am a dudes (yes I am trying to be funny with that grammatical mistake, you may or may not chuckle). I think that the problems men face that women don't are mostly societal. As far as having the crappy end of the reproductive system women take the prize I agree, but I think men have always had it worse in society than women. I think George Carlin puts it best in the "male disease". He talks about how men are taught by society to hide any sort of emotion they have because it is seen as unmanly. That men are taught to be totally manly all the time and anything else is a sign of weakness that is beat out of you (sometimes literally sometimes not so literally). Men have also always been forced to go off to war. It is always men who are handed guns and told to go kill people. Society does this because men have already been taught not to show feeling, so men are expected to kill people and not feel bad about it. Then every so often a man decides that they feel bad about killing people, they are called weak and cowardly. Some men even decide that it is not a good idea to kill people. Those men are labeled as draft dodgers and enemy supporters. Then you have kids. When boys get bullied they are told that they need to be tough and grow some balls. Do I think women's lives are all sugar and rainbows? no. But as a dude I think that guys have harder lives than women. So that, how they say, is that. 

[Boo Radley]

I think it's divided.  Physically, women.  Child birth and pressure to eat right and be thin is stressful and painful.  It's difficult to always look your best.

But, socially, men.  Society holds certain expectations for men that women don't have.  Today, women can be independent and strong, but ,men cannot be housekeepers without ridicule.  It depends on the opinion.

[CD]

I'd like to make a point we might be all missing because we're talking about the usual issues of male/female.

The genders that have it worst are transgender, transsexual and intersex people.  Not even legally recognised, all too frequently medically abused,  pigeon holed by their families in what is often the reverse gender they later identify with, subject to all the bullying and cruelty of homosexual people without any of the legal or social recognition that this is wrong, no right to marry (even someone of the 'opposite' sex) and yes, were also gassed along with other people the Nazis didn't like.

For all my gripes about being a woman (including that the sexism against my gender goes so far as to render it seen as incapable of cruelty, something I think we can call agree is untrue, and bad for males and females alike) -----I can at least say, my existence is acknowledged.

So spare a thought for the TI people in LGBTIQ peoples when havin'  a whinge about men's and women's business.

[Story-Master Laila]

Wow. I didn't even think about that.
One thing I'm proud to say about Pakistan, despite the horrible things women here have to endure in some of the rural and tribal areas (see: honour killings, acid attacks, "being married to Quran"--something which is ACTUALLY done in some feudal areas so that the property stays within the family) is that we treat our hermaphrodites and transexuals pretty damn well. It's true, that open crossdressers are often unemployed here, and there are a lot of them walking the street begging for money (btw, they don't actually have it that bad, some of them are just conmen =P) but everybody has sympathy for them. It's not often that they'll be beaten or driven to the point of suicide by discrimination. They actually have their own colonies (for those disowned by their families) and some of them are quite content with it. While their families may kick them out, our  society doesn't totally shun them. Also this guy is one of our biggest celebrities: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1Z4m1HxUoA

[Story-Master Laila]

Also some Muslim Scholar passed a fatwa saying sex change is legal under Islamist laws. I know a woman who wrote to them asking if she could get a sex change operation.

[Jamillia Joy]

Before I actually commented, I wanted to read through the thread, and I can totally understand the points that are coming from both sides. But, as I am coming from a place of privilege, I'm going to say that women have it harder. Biologically, our bodies do more- the menstruation, child birth, menopause, etc.- and socially, I think that women are constantly being critique from everyone and everything- the media, men, and other women are constantly trying to tear us down. Men are involved in more wars, gang activity, and probably do commit suicide more than women. But women are more likely to suffer from depression, eating disorders, and anxiety disorders because I think that women- like men- are expected to deal with the pressures that come from all sides, or they are labeled whiny, stupid, and are looked on as inferior by members of their sex and the opposite sex. (i.e., Some women look down on other women who complain or talk about their menstrual cramps because they feel that all men will view them as whiners, and the same thing for men who don't cry because they feel that they will be viewed as weak, or gay.)
Women just have it worse. I wish it wasn't the truth, but it is.

[Hutch Hogan]

I think the problem is that we're fighting over who has the bigger problems, why are we so fickle so as to yell about who is a victim, instead of trying to solve the problems of any size? 

[Vertigo_One [Ops Mod]]

It's not fickle. Here's the issue. By not conceptualising a lot of problem as a gender issue, it fails to get attention. Because of this, lots of issues have not been solved that could have been.

[Hutch Hogan]

I don't particularly see the need to make anything into an issue of gender.   If a person says "Hey, I'm doing the same job as person Y, yet person Y is making an obscene amount more."  Then it's worth investigating. 

If we inflame the problems by saying that it is a principle of gender, then the problem can get so easily lost in the fickle rabble. 

[Vertigo_One [Ops Mod]]

I don't particularly see the need to make anything into an issue of gender.   If a person says "Hey, I'm doing the same job as person Y, yet person Y is making an obscene amount more."  Then it's worth investigating.

 

Its basic science. If you say "We notice that X group is getting paid less, is there a correlation?" etc.

[Hutch Hogan]

The thing is that people will debate that it isn't about gender, the major focus for wage will shift to married v. single, but I'm sure you're already aware of that.