Question for the Lady Nerdfighters

[Jessie Arr]

Okay, some quick background: I'm a guy who recently found out that my ex cheated on me while we were together. (This was the second time, I stupidly forgave her the first time.)

Furthermore, when I kissed a girl for the first time it was on a Tuesday. I asked her to be my girlfriend, she agreed, then she made out with another guy at a party the following Friday while I was in the bathroom.

So, while I'm normally a wee bit misogynistic, I'm feeling especially negative towards women at present. So I have a question I'd like all the girls who've had serious relationships to answer completely honestly for me:

Q: Have you ever cheated on a guy? (kissing counts)

I know that cheating is fairly common, but my own personal experience has left me with 4/5 relationships where I got cheated on. Is it really this common, am I making too big a deal out of it?

I'm in college, it'd be simple for me to just go to a frat party and hook up, but I keep avoiding that because I'm holding out for someone I can really connect with. I'd like to make love rather than f***, if that makes sense. I'm a virgin, but not for lack of opportunity.

I keep hoping that most girls wouldn't cheat on someone, but the girl who cheated on me (twice) seemed really great. She was a nerdfighter, read books (not Twilight, real books), and played more video games than me even. The first time I went over to her house I found the Complete Works of Edgar Allen Poe under her pillow and thought to myself "Yep, this could be the one." We even went to meet John and Hank together. Then she cheated on me.

So I guess my point is: is this normal behavior for women? Is it just what happens when a girl's not 100% happy in her relationship? Should I stop making such a big deal about it and just fool around with girls until I happen across someone really awesome? Or have I just had staggeringly bad luck?

Thanks for reading my wall-o-text, I'd be interested to hear some female opinions on the matter. (Funny story, I was sitting at home thinking to myself 'man, I need to find a bunch of girls to talk to about this, but where?' then I remembered that Nerdfighteria is like 2/3 female. Score one for Nerdfighteria!)

[Gretalaurelina]

I used to be a serial cheater (not proud of it), so I can give you a bit of insight my situation, but I really feel like I need to throw in the disclaimer that everybody is different, and so are the reasons behind their actions. Ok, disclaimer done, here's my story...

I think the reasons I cheated were because I didn't take the relationships I was in very seriously, because there was no emotional investment in them. Similar to your situation with the first girl you kissed, a guy would ask me out, and before I knew it, I'd be their 'girlfriend' - if you could call it that. Now I think being someone's girlfriend means you're dedicated to the relationship, and it's difficult to achieve that dedication in such a short period of time. I didn't consider it such a commitment back then. I think I viewed the guys that I cheated with in the same way I viewed the guys I cheated on - someone I liked and wanted to see casually, but not necessarily wanting to be exclusively committed to.

As I got older, I started to get more experience with guys (not the way you're thinking - well, not only that way!), and started dating more than being boyfriend/girlfriend. I know that you said you're not looking to go to a party and hook up, but that doesn't mean you can't start to casually see people until you find someone who you connect with.

In my situation, I did find someone who I connected with (and not instantly - love at first sight is a myth in my opinion), and have never cheated on him in 9 years because I am absolutely committed. The saying 'once a cheater, always a cheater' is definitely not accurate, so don't judge future possible girlfriends by their past. My main piece of advice is to make sure a girl feels the same way as you do before you go down the girlfriend/boyfriend path - you can't force someone to be committed to you. If she really does like you, she won't cheat.

[Olivia]

Love at first "sight," yes. Love at first meeting? I disagree. You can't love someone based solely on appearance (that would be lust). However, once you know them a little, you can love them based on that little bit.
Now, my first example isn't remotely romantic love. I went to my first wizard rock concert at a store near my house. I loved the owners within five minutes of being in that building. They are awesome.
Second example isn't really "love," although it has since developed into such. I belong to a group on Facebook created by one of my friends. I am one of the officers. My description says something like "In charge of Harry Potter/Doctor Who-related things." Other than the creator, there was only one other officer- another one of his friends who I didn't know at the time. His description said "crazy awesome at computer stuff guy." I thought "This is someone I could definitely like. As in, like-like."
That was in early August. Late August came, and with it the start of school. This same guy turned out to be in three of my four classes, plus lunch. We became friends instantly. And considering both of our personalities, that's pretty impressive. It takes me a long time to make friends. Usually. Within the first week, I definitely liked him. Within the first two or three, after he sent me an unbearably clever, geeky, and downright wonderful email, I dared to think to myself that I loved him. I still do. He doesn't know. Our friendship is too important to me to make incredibly awkward just for that chance. (I've ambiguously invited him to a few things in ways that could be interpreted as asking-out or just as friends. Things have always come up so he can't attend.)
So I do believe in "Love at first sight," to that degree.

[noxy]

-The response Greta gave is one great response. It was truely insightful to someone like myself. I am not a cheater - have never cheated on anyone, nor do I plan to. I'm incredibly faithful, though I can't say the same thing about most of my ex boyfriends. There are those of us out there. And your "is this normal behavior for women? Is it just what happens when a girl's not 100% happy in her relationship?" Can easily be reversed for women to ask to men. I don't believe all women cheat, just as I don't believe all men cheat. But cheaters are out there, and it sucks when non-cheaters encounter them.

Don't give up! And um, cheating is a big deal to those who get cheated on. So I'd suggest you not "just fool around with girls until you happen across someone really awesome," because then what happens if you're still "fooling around" when you meet ms. awesome, and she ends up posting a similar thread to yours in the nerdfighters forum? Bet that wouldn't feel very awesome...

[Jessie Arr]

Thanks for the responses. It's good to hear some feedback from other people. It helped me to look at things from her perspective and that's helped me figure out the situation a lot more. I think she's had a lot of really unfulfilling long term relationships in the past so I think she's lost faith in relationships and just wants to meet as many guys as possible to see if any of us are different. Not good for me, but at least I can see where she's coming from.

I've talked to her about it since I originally posted this and she's actually been pretty honest with me, so I feel a little bit better. I guess I was just in kind of a funk. I went swing dancing last night with some friends, it was a lot of fun, and I got a girl's number to boot. I feel like it's a lot better environment for the sort of relationships I'm looking for than bars and parties, so I'm definitely going to go swing dancing again.

"I know that you said you're not looking to go to a party and hook up, but that doesn't mean you can't start to casually see people until you find someone who you connect with."

I do go to parties, probably twice a month or so, but so many girls at parties are just looking to fool around and have fun. Which is fine, but not what really I'm looking for. Then I met a girl who seemed really different and she cheated on me so I kinda started to wonder if maybe it was just every college girl. It's hard to keep faith when you're consistently disappointed :P

Anyways, I'm still a bit gun-shy I suppose, but I'm out of my funk and plan to start going swing dancing every week. It's a great way to meet girls and a lot of fun besides, plus it just seems to have a better atmosphere for the kinds of friends and girls I'm looking for. People don't go there to hook up, they go there to dance and meet people. I can get on board with that, and I've been wanting to learn to dance for ages anyway.

I'll remember next time to communicate with the girl more about whatever we are, just to be sure we're on the same page. I don't think my ex would have lied to me if I'd asked what she was about, I just didn't realize it was needed and she kept me in the dark so I wouldn't ask.

Thanks again for your opinions. It's good to hear from third parties on the subject :)

[C-Line]

just a responce to this, as far as finding a special someone in college, parties with drinking are the worst way to go. some of the girls are a little tipsy and might only want a night of fun, i know i was a sorority girl i went to a few frat parties. the thing is at those parties you meet no one of substance, i suggest sticking with the "good clean fun" of swing dancing.

[Cassie Sheets]

I've never cheated on anyone, It shouldn't be something most girls commonly do. But if a girl's not 100% happy, she should probably take a break from the relationship if she's considering cheating on someone. It is a big deal, my thought is you've had bad luck.

I can see how stuff may happen, but 4/5 just isn't something any guy should ever have to deal with :( Even 1/5 is a bit much.

[Kayley Scruggs]

Have you ever cheated on a guy? (kissing counts)
I have cheated one time out of my six serious relationships. I didn't cheat because I was just bored or wanted to fool around. I did it because I was still in love with my ex. I got together with Kevin like a week after I broke up with Austin. I was pissed at Austin for saying some really rude things to me, so I started dating Kevin. Before I knew it, I told Kevin that I loved him, which I later realized wasn't true. Anyway, six months into my relationship with Kevin, I got back into contact with him through his girlfriend at the time, who was also kind of my friend. We told each other we still loved each other, but for some reason neither of us didn't break up with our boyfriend/girlfriend. Then he came to my house alone and we kissed. Kevin found out and stayed with me anyway, but I ended up breaking up with him a month later.

is this normal behavior for women?
No, and it's not only women. Both sexes cheat (I believe about equally) for many reasons. But it's not normal for anyone.

Is it just what happens when a girl's not 100% happy in her relationship?
I can't speak for all girls, but I was miserable in my relationship that I cheated in. I've been unhappy in relationships since then, and I didn't cheat. I think girls cheat for many reasons.

Should I stop making such a big deal about it and just fool around with girls until I happen across someone really awesome?
No, it is a pretty big deal, but I don't think you should over-analyze it. I don't think you should blame it on yourself. And you should "fool around" with girls just because you haven't found the right one with. Don't do something sexual with anyone just because you feel like you should've by now. If you're emotionally ready to hook up with girls, that's fine. But I'm all for saving your virginity for that special someone. Also, you probably should focus too much on thinking "Would this girl cheat on me?" and such. If you worry, bad things will probably happen. Just relax and let the right girl show up naturally.

Or have I just had staggeringly bad luck?
I have no answer to this question... but don't blame yourself unless you're being a jerk. I'm sure you're not.

Also, I'd like to add that the reason why I cheated was complex, and I believe that most people who cheat also have complex reasons to their stories. Personally, I would never do it again.

[Alix Kerr]

I've never cheated on anyone in my life. Cheating disgusts me actually. I got cheated on today actually. Blah.

[Jaqueline Sparrow]

Nope. Mostly because I've never had a guy. I'm 18, and being my nerdy self, I still figure that's too young. Plus, as much as guys are easier to understand than girls, they still blow my mind, I can't wrap my mind around them at all. So I'm waiting.

I know just stepping out of the relationship game is often the last option people want to take... but I'd still recommend it. You have the time and energy to build great friendships; and if one of those friendships slowly leads to more, you know the person well enough (and know their dating history well enough) to know what you're getting into.

[Katie H]

There is sometimes a problem defining 'cheating' even after saying kissing counts.

By my definition no, I have never cheated.

However, while I was in my one and only LTR I did once make out with someone else. Said someone was a female friend, it was purely a drunk-at-a-party sort of thing, it posed no threat to my relationship with my boyfriend. And for the record that bf had previously requested that I kiss girls at parties... then thrown fits when I did.

I was definitely unhappy in that relationship, though. Although I had lost 30 lbs just before meeting that guy, he frequently told me I was fat and needed to lose 10 lbs or so (which would put me underweight), that I was stupid, etc. In my 2 year relationship with him I completely lost track of who I was because he controlled everything I did and everyone I saw until when it was over (when he went from emotionally to physically abusive) I basically had to start my social life from scratch - I had no friends left.

So yeah, I was unhappy. I was probably chafing at that relationship and the control he had on me more than a little bit. But I still don't consider it cheating.

[Mr. E]

I too have a problem with this definition. (Kissing counts)

Cheating is whatever you and your partner agree it is. Some couples fuck other people openly, and are cool with it. For others a flirtatious line in an email to someone a thousand miles away is crossing the line.

I would be comfortable saying that kissing is the default place to draw the line. But this is a definition each couple needs to come to on their own.

Anyway, as for advice...

I think you need to be true to your own values. You clearly don't appreciate cheating. Why would you subject another human being to what you went through?

No, women don't all cheat. Don't get too caught up in dwelling on this, that concern can become a self-fulfilling prophecy (been there, done that). People pick up on each others thoughts through subtle, sometimes unspoken cues. You need to project the fact that fidelity is valued and respected by you, if that's what you want.

[The Black Knight]

Wtf?! Twilight is a REAL book. Fuck you.