Capitalism vs Socialism

[Konduktør]

I am a nerdfighter who like politics, and I am a socialist. I have recently wondered why not more countries are socilistic, since this have turned alright for Norway. I would love your views on this case :)

[Alix Laya]

I believe in the strength of the individual.  I think that if you earn money, you should keep your money.  I think that people should be able to start a business and let it prosper.  I don't think we need government in everything.  Capitalism turned out alright in the U.S. for hundreds of years, and now that people have more socialist tendencies, we're the laughing stalk of the internet.

[Konduktør]

But what about those who doesn't have that strength? The handicapped for example?

[Vertigo_One [Ops Mod]]

I believe in the strength of the individual.  I think that if you earn money, you should keep your money.  I think that people should be able to start a business and let it prosper.  I don't think we need government in everything.

 

I think if this is your opinion, you misunderstand the nature of the OP. It said "socialistic" not "communist". As Barack Obama rightly said, if you start a business, you didn't do that alone. You required the state's assistance for sharing the cost of things like the roads that allow customers to travel to you, and for you to ship your product, or if your an internet company, the electricity cables that provide your services etc. You share the cost of the police who stop criminals destroying your business, you share the cost of the education that informs and equips your workforce, you share the cost of a military that protects the country you operate within.

In short, you share the cost of many things in a socialistic manner already. You already have the government in many things. Therefore, following your philosophy of "if you earn money you should keep your money" the government takes that which you did not earn. IE that which is necessary to maintain the services which your business relies upon.

What countries like Norway et al do is broaden this and seek to make it more effective. America, for some reason, is fearful of this, worried that it will end up with the state controlling their lives.

[God ~blogs admin ~]

Preach!

[Cameron Ch.]

+like

[Abreo]

The U.S isn't capitalistic despite the buzz word being popular in media, it's mixed. Medicare, Social Security, public schools, and many other things don't exist in pure capitalism so if you enjoy the U.S system you can't possibly support capitalism in and of itself. Anyways capitalism is a system that supports corporations and other pyramid shaped groups. Capitalism does not support individuals. The only system that could be said to believe in the strength of the individual to any extent is anarchism.\

[Latch33570]

America can do with lessof that socialistic crap and more capitalism. It would be better off with more private schools and less of that crappy public school.

VERTY that was a bunch of hogwash when he said it and when you repeated it. Roads and other utilities he acted as if the state gave special privileges to a non tax payer and that is why they were able to open a business and not you. There are things that are better off done as a group effort but not everything. We value our individualty and freedom from govt bothersome interference.

America is mostly capitalist.

Socialism sucks.

[Vertigo_One [Ops Mod]]

America can do with lessof that socialistic crap and more capitalism. It would be better off with more private schools and less of that crappy public school.

Private schools create elitism, and destroy social mobility. How are the people who don't have any money for a private school supposed to get their children a good education without a good school. I would be in favour of a voucher system though.

VERTY that was a bunch of hogwash when he said it and when you repeated it. Roads and other utilities he acted as if the state gave special privileges to a non tax payer and that is why they were able to open a business and not you.

Erm... no he didn't. He just pointed out that people should pay taxes because when you make a business, you had to use things that taxpayers pay for to get that business running. It's true also that if you've made a very successful business, chances are you're more reliant on the tax payer funded infrastructre/services than others, and so should pay more.

There are things that are better off done as a group effort but not everything. We value our individualty and freedom from govt bothersome interference.

Right, but right now America could use more government interference. Say, the regulation of the oil industry to stop big spills? Or the provision of healthcare that everyone can afford?

[Latch33570]

"Private schools create elitism, and destroy social mobility"    Where's the proof.

I am in favor of vouchers also.   "
Erm... no he didn't. He just pointed out that people should pay taxes because when you make a business"   Yes he did. His demeanor was and democrats in general  is that people succeed because it is handed to them or they cheated people. Rarely do they acknowledge exceptional hard work as the cause of prosperity.

Obviously some regulation is necessary but not to the point of it interfering with business. Healthcare is a prime example. Keep in mind I do not know the solution. The cost of bringing a new drug to market is between 3 and 11 billion. http://www.forbes.com/sites/matthewherper/2012/02/10/the-truly-stag... I suspect that that cost is because of all the various animal test and studies even before testing. That drives up cost. Can it be done cheaper, probably.Would it be as safe, probably not. Point is some govt is OK too much is crappy and interferes with innovation. Socialism is too much govt. It sucks and rewards piss poor performance and punishes harder workers with extra taxes to give to lazy and people with poor work habits.   

 

[Vertigo_One [Ops Mod]]

Where's the proof.

 

How about the fact that the UK has had so many prime ministers from Eton? And that private schools have lower class sizes and overall better results? Why? Because they have more money.

Yes he did. His demeanor was and democrats in general  is that people succeed because it is handed to them or they cheated people. Rarely do they acknowledge exceptional hard work as the cause of prosperity.

No, that's not true. They acknowledge hard work as A cause of prosperity, not THE cause. Hard work is only one factor. There are other factors such as the governments provision of services. And it is perfectly reasonable to demand money to support those services in the form of taxation. And it is equally reasonable to demand more of those with more money, since the inference is that they will use those same services more than most.

Socialism is too much govt. It sucks and rewards piss poor performance and punishes harder workers with extra taxes to give to lazy and people with poor work habits.

Two words. Explain Norway.

An incredibly rich, affluent country with a very socialistic system. How can they be considered lazy?

[Latch33570]

That is not proof that it creates elitism or destroys social mobility. It is a great example of pro private schools. Like I said vouchers would be great and do away with public schools.

You are right about hard work not being the only thing. You must invest and have a workable plan. Most people do not do that. They just plod thru life and expect that when things go wrong, and it will, the govt will bail them out.       I don't have a problem with wealthier people paying more in taxes. Where did you get that?  

Among failures you found one success. I haven't looked up Norway but I will. Not that it matters just because it works for them there does not mean that it will work everywhere. I will research it.

[Latch33570]

" There are other factors such as the governments provision of services. "  Since those goods and services provided by the govt are available to everyone that isn't a factor.

"

Two words. Explain Norway.

An incredibly rich, affluent country with a very socialistic system. How can they be considered lazy?"    I wasn't calling Norwegians lazy.  Norway is an exception. They have a small population I know the govt owns a large portion of their oil and gas company. I wonder how much that affects it. I wish there was a way to tell. Where could I look that up?     I read that they have a flat tax I really like that.